Divine Power and attacks per round

WrathOG777 · Post by **WrathOG777** » Thu Jan 06, 2005 9:59 pm

right, what nob is saying.

Just right now, instead of changing bab at all... it is Adding the assumed difference from cleric to AB and giving you an extra attack.

So instead of +15/10/5 -> 20/15/10/5
it goes 15/10/5 +5 +1attack -> 20/15/10/20

Lucien · Post by **Lucien** » Thu Jan 06, 2005 10:02 pm

WrathOG777 wrote:right, what nob is saying.

Just right now, instead of changing bab at all... it is Adding the assumed difference from cleric to AB and giving you an extra attack.

So instead of +15/10/5 -> 20/15/10/5
it goes 15/10/5 +5 +1attack -> 20/15/10/20

But Wrath, doesn't it sound like it is changing the BAB, without capping it properly? Why else would Rhiss get two extra attacks instead of just one?

In other words, it's doing both of the things you mentioned.

Nob · Post by **Nob** » Thu Jan 06, 2005 10:03 pm

Essentially, I think they reused the haste code for additional attacks when originally coding divine power.

loki70 · Post by **loki70** » Thu Jan 06, 2005 10:22 pm

So, what happens to a high level monk fighting weaponless?

Fire Monkey · Post by **Fire Monkey** » Thu Jan 06, 2005 10:22 pm

I think its even more screwed than you think. I know an epic strength based fighter type character who still gets I think a +2 BAB bonus despite the fact that all levels are fighter types. I also know an epic character with 20+ fighter type levels and additional non-fighter type levels. As their first 20 levels were as a fighter type they should get no BAB bonus from Divnie Power, but they still get I think +2 a bonus as well.

Neither should be getting anything.

WrathOG777 · Post by **WrathOG777** » Thu Jan 06, 2005 10:30 pm

loki70 wrote:So, what happens to a high level monk fighting weaponless?

That would be the best way to test if it is really giveing more bab. because they would get a boat load of attacks.

But the long and short of this is...

Tensers blows this out of the water. It really does give 1bab/2lvl, 2d4 str/dex, 1d4 hp/lvl, martial weapon prof, etc.

So no need to cry about divine power being great on a scroll for non-clerics. Tensers is what folks use.

Serineth Swiftpaw · Post by **Serineth Swiftpaw** » Thu Jan 06, 2005 10:32 pm

loki70 wrote:So, what happens to a high level monk fighting weaponless?

Exploit Eddy

Rhissaerk Jalesh · Post by **Rhissaerk Jalesh** » Thu Jan 06, 2005 10:37 pm

I think that divine power may set your BAB to be equal to your character level regardless of your classes. Since epic classes, even if they are pure fighters, don't get their AB raised every level, that would explain it giving a boost to even pure fighter types.

WrathOG777 · Post by **WrathOG777** » Thu Jan 06, 2005 10:56 pm

Rhissaerk Jalesh wrote:I think that divine power may set your BAB to be equal to your character level regardless of your classes. Since epic classes, even if they are pure fighters, don't get their AB raised every level, that would explain it giving a boost to even pure fighter types.

That would make it word for word what it is supposed to do. We all just think that is super powerful.

So say some lvl 26 rogue uses the scroll. 26 bab -> 26/21/16/11/6/1 then +3 EAB -> 29/24/19/14/9/4 as their base. Powerful, yes, what the spell is supposed to do... yes.

BAB stops at 20. What epic characters get is not bab, it is Epic attack bonus. So if it really does change BAB, it would do exactly what rhis is saying.

I hope that clears up any confusion.

KenLie · Post by **KenLie** » Thu Jan 06, 2005 11:18 pm

Does this means that my dwarf would get 8 attacks/round when he casts haste and drinks divine potions? (as default he has 6(twoweaponfighter), hasted 7, haven't tried divine presence...hilarous)

WrathOG777 · Post by **WrathOG777** » Thu Jan 06, 2005 11:21 pm

KenLie wrote:Does this means that my dwarf would get 8 attacks/round when he casts haste and drinks divine potions? (as default he has 6(twoweaponfighter), hasted 7, haven't tried divine presence...hilarous)

Helps clerics. Only makes sence that if it is a potion, it would help fighters too.

Rhissaerk Jalesh · Post by **Rhissaerk Jalesh** » Fri Jan 07, 2005 12:20 am

Yes, Ken, it should give you 8 attacks a round, unless there is some kinda engine attack cap. Scary spell considering it can be bought in a potion.

Fire Monkey · Post by **Fire Monkey** » Fri Jan 07, 2005 12:24 am

Rhissaerk Jalesh wrote:Yes, Ken, it should give you 8 attacks a round, unless there is some kinda engine attack cap. Scary spell considering it can be bought in a potion.

At least it is thankfully short-lived. Unless you are an epic cleric of course........ But then they need an insane BAB to compliment there +5 weapons, armour and shields

.

The hand04 · Post by **The hand04** » Fri Jan 07, 2005 3:33 am

KenLie wrote:Does this means that my dwarf would get 8 attacks/round when he casts haste and drinks divine potions? (as default he has 6(twoweaponfighter), hasted 7, haven't tried divine presence...hilarous)

Only gives Taran the normal 4 attacks per round/ 5 hasted.. The only AB bonus i'm getting is +4, which is handy for 1000 gp a bottle.

Fire Monkey · Post by **Fire Monkey** » Fri Jan 07, 2005 3:47 am

The hand04 wrote:
KenLie wrote:Does this means that my dwarf would get 8 attacks/round when he casts haste and drinks divine potions? (as default he has 6(twoweaponfighter), hasted 7, haven't tried divine presence...hilarous)
Only gives Taran the normal 4 attacks per round/ 5 hasted.. The only AB bonus i'm getting is +4, which is handy for 1000 gp a bottle.

Not bad seeing as you shouldn't be getting any at all according to the spell description.

kombinat · Post by **kombinat** » Fri Jan 07, 2005 4:28 am

This issue is why we've banned the spell from the Scaled Gauntlets until it's fixed.

ave · Post by **ave** » Fri Jan 07, 2005 8:01 am

kombinat wrote:This issue is why we've banned the spell from the Scaled Gauntlets until it's fixed.

These potions have saved my life and the life of others many times. Go ahead and "fix" them now , as if the non-casters had an easy life

Khaelindra · Post by **Khaelindra** » Fri Jan 07, 2005 8:17 am

WrathOG777 wrote:
Rhissaerk Jalesh wrote:I think that divine power may set your BAB to be equal to your character level regardless of your classes. Since epic classes, even if they are pure fighters, don't get their AB raised every level, that would explain it giving a boost to even pure fighter types.
That would make it word for word what it is supposed to do. We all just think that is super powerful.

So say some lvl 26 rogue uses the scroll. 26 bab -> 26/21/16/11/6/1 then +3 EAB -> 29/24/19/14/9/4 as their base. Powerful, yes, what the spell is supposed to do... yes.

BAB stops at 20. What epic characters get is not bab, it is Epic attack bonus. So if it really does change BAB, it would do exactly what rhis is saying.

I hope that clears up any confusion.

Wrath, if this is what it does, then it doesn't do what it should do.

BAB can never get higher than 20, so a spell that gives you 21+ BAB with accompanying 5th/6th base attack is -NOT- doing things right. As the EAB stays, there should be no reason for the BAB to go beyond 20 as by definition this is capped at 20. The spell is meant to give fighter BAB, and the BAB of a lvl 40 fighter is still only 20.

I still write it down to lazyness if it indeed simply translates your level to BAB and gives you 1+rounddown[(lvl-1)/5] attacks. It would mean that a lvl 36+ mage would get a base of eight (8!!!) attacks per round, 9 with haste, 11 with dual wield, 17 attacks maximum for a monk...it really becomes rediculous that way.

Khaelindra · Post by **Khaelindra** » Fri Jan 07, 2005 8:18 am

ave wrote:
kombinat wrote:This issue is why we've banned the spell from the Scaled Gauntlets until it's fixed.
These potions have saved my life and the life of others many times. Go ahead and "fix" them now , as if the non-casters had an easy life

Use invisibility and withdraw...only 160 gold for the potion and it works wonderful.

kombinat · Post by **kombinat** » Fri Jan 07, 2005 8:23 am

Khaelindra wrote:
ave wrote:
kombinat wrote:This issue is why we've banned the spell from the Scaled Gauntlets until it's fixed.
These potions have saved my life and the life of others many times. Go ahead and "fix" them now , as if the non-casters had an easy life
Use invisibility and withdraw...only 160 gold for the potion and it works wonderful.

Tactics? Partying up? Surely you jest.

ave · Post by **ave** » Fri Jan 07, 2005 8:35 am

kombinat wrote:
Khaelindra wrote:
ave wrote:
kombinat wrote:This issue is why we've banned the spell from the Scaled Gauntlets until it's fixed.
These potions have saved my life and the life of others many times. Go ahead and "fix" them now , as if the non-casters had an easy life
Use invisibility and withdraw...only 160 gold for the potion and it works wonderful.
Tactics? Partying up? Surely you jest.

To me always it gives a +4 to all attacks. Never got more attacks. And lasts preety short too (5 rounds i think)also costs a fortune so is not that i use all time. Why is that so bad? People on Avlis are using this for ages. Noone had problem with that before. As far as tactics go there go till some point. But beyond that point only gear ,luck and potions like that would make you survive. and i mean situation when exploring new area got into fight the wrong monster and 2/3 of the party bleeding and it is you and the monster badly wounded but still hard to hit it and you got to make it and fast so to heal the rest.

Fix the extra atatcks if you must (still i say i never got any extra) . But what am i saying , things have gone their way anyway...

Khaelindra · Post by **Khaelindra** » Fri Jan 07, 2005 9:00 am

ave wrote:. Why is that so bad? People on Avlis are using this for ages. Noone had problem with that before.

Noone has been lvl 36+ before. As long as people were capped at level 20, the problem didn't exist. It's the epic levels, with their EAB and their [bab=level] equation corrupting the #/attacks logic of the engine with regard to this spell, that are breaking it as we speak. The higher people get above lvl 20 when using this spell, the worse the effects.

I REALLY don't won't to see a monk with 17 attacks, thank you...

Serineth Swiftpaw · Post by **Serineth Swiftpaw** » Fri Jan 07, 2005 9:49 am

Khaelindra wrote:
ave wrote:
kombinat wrote:This issue is why we've banned the spell from the Scaled Gauntlets until it's fixed.
These potions have saved my life and the life of others many times. Go ahead and "fix" them now , as if the non-casters had an easy life
Use invisibility and withdraw...only 160 gold for the potion and it works wonderful.

No they dont

I was trapped the other day trying to escape and every time I drank one my character would make an AoO in a second or two later breaking off my insivibility, I drank about 5 potions before giving up and accepting defeat

Luckily I was still bugged from a scroll I read though and techincally invincible so it kind of evened out

Nob · Post by **Nob** » Fri Jan 07, 2005 9:53 am

I've double checked on what Divine Power actually does when cast...(this was on Hala though, so I'm not sure if Avlis spellhooking has changed it any.)

Divine Power currently adds a blanket +4 to your AB, the hp is as described and gives you one additional attack at full AB. Hence it's like haste with benefits and no movement speed increase.

The AB additions seems to be universal.

KenLie · Post by **KenLie** » Fri Jan 07, 2005 9:53 am

Serineth Swiftpaw wrote:No they dont
I was trapped the other day trying to escape and every time I drank one my character would make an AoO in a second or two later breaking off my insivibility, I drank about 5 potions before giving up and accepting defeat Luckily I was still bugged from a scroll I read though and techincally invincible so it kind of evened out

Use a bow?