Request ruling on 'cheesing' a bloodline

hrpatton · Post by **hrpatton** » Fri Mar 19, 2004 12:16 am

Ahoy.

I've been reading the 3rd Ed. Unearthed Arcana supplement, and the bloodline option has got me wondering about Avlis characters with tainted or mixed blood.

Specifically, I'm kicking around the idea of an old-school cambion, a half-human/half-infernal crossbreed. hey're called 'tieflings' now, but that has to be the wussiest name for a cool concept I've ever heard.)

Now, I know tieflings aren't a recognized Avlis race, and so 'cheesing' one is expressly forbidden. What about a character whose infernal blood gives him certain physical traits and behavioral tendencies, but no unusual abilities?

In my specific case, I want to play a character with visible diabolic traits (horns, red skin) that are easily implemented in the character creator, and some secondary traits (faint smell of brimstone, eyes of changing color) that can be put into a description. The character will be human for all game mechanical purposes, and will not be 'cheesing' any abilities Avlis does not allow humans of his class and level (no lighting cigars with his breath or claiming to speak Infernal). He'll have an imp familiar and cast a lot of fire spells, and may even try to induce others toward devil worship, but he won't claim diabolic favor or sanction.

Is this cheesing? If it is, what would I have to do to bring the character in line?

Post by **tindertwiggy** » Fri Mar 19, 2004 12:33 am

Check out Abyss404. You can play a true tiefling (racial traits made in game with autobic) there. I think Rockhome may have such in place as well. I am not sure about the other CoPaP worlds, but the CoPaP forums would be a good place to ask if they run autobic and if they have tiefling support.

As for Avlis, give the team a day or two to discuss it.

hrpatton · Post by **hrpatton** » Fri Mar 19, 2004 12:38 am

tindertwiggy wrote:
As for Avlis, give the team a day or two to discuss it.

Thank you.

Drakuul · Post by **Drakuul** » Fri Mar 19, 2004 1:17 am

http://www.hala-world.org/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=19

Hala is using the Abyss404 char gen too, so tieflings are a custom race there.

Xiaou · Post by **Xiaou** » Fri Mar 19, 2004 2:15 am

The description for RDD mentions red dragon blood as a power source for innate casters. As per Sindol's reminder Avlis does not have red dragons and ergo no RDD's.

There is however a book I've run across in game that mentions something along the lines of dragon heritage being responsible for the capabilities of sorcerers and bards. I'll go through the libraries & bookshops to come up with the title if someone wants that done.

So my questions are: 1.) Should characters with decent lore skills tell non-wizard arcane users that their ability comes from dragon heritage? 2.) If its incorrect and dragon heritage is a false source then where does innate arcane talent come from?

Jordicus · Post by **Jordicus** » Fri Mar 19, 2004 2:23 am

the book that talks about sorcerors & dragons says something like "it is rumored", it does not say that it fact...

i think it is up to the individual player to come up with a reasonable IC background for their sorceror. but remember, Mortal Magic comes from the Vortex of Mortal Magic and that is the domain of Andrinor, so that should always be taken into consideration.

Aloro · Post by **Aloro** » Fri Mar 19, 2004 3:05 am

There are dragons in Avlis, just not the standard chromatic ones.

A sorceror can always BELIEVE his or her abilities come from some sort of dragon heritage, just as he or she can BELIEVE that his or her abilities are granted by the fairies, or by a distant ancestor being cursed by a council of mages, or by direct divine intercession.

Believing a thing does not make it so.

- Aloro

Vroshgrak · Post by **Vroshgrak** » Fri Mar 19, 2004 3:10 am

Just as Vrosh believes he is a descendant of The'ton!

Post by **Orleron** » Fri Mar 19, 2004 4:05 am

Minor correction:

Human + Demon = Cambion

Cambion + Human = Tiefling

Tiefling + Tiefling = Tiefling

Tiefling + Demon = Cambion

Tiefling + Cambion = Tiefling

Tiefling + Human = character with some inconsequential demon traits like horns, red eyes, etc. but basically plays as a human PC

hrpatton · Post by **hrpatton** » Fri Mar 19, 2004 3:11 pm

Orleron wrote:Minor correction:

Tiefling + Human = character with some inconsequential demon traits like horns, red eyes, etc. but basically plays as a human PC

^

Yes, this is what I had in mind: a character with obviously infernal traits and tendencies, but human for all game mechanical purposes. If anyone should ask about his race, he'd call himself human, but mention that his great-grandfather was said to consort with devils....

I know lots of people do similar things without asking, but I wanted to be on the safe side in case a DM overhears my character talking about his "infernal blood" and thinking he's trying to cheese a cambion/tiefling in-game.

I understand the problem cheesing causes the designers and DMs, so I'll drop the character idea if it's going to be a headache.

The ruling request, I suppose, is this: Is it legitimate to claim a racial heritage so long as it doesn't grant any powers, and so long as it doesn't imply a change in the race/type?

Post by **Orleron** » Fri Mar 19, 2004 3:18 pm

The ruling request, I suppose, is this: Is it legitimate to claim a racial heritage so long as it doesn't grant any powers, and so long as it doesn't imply a change in the race/type?

The response is yes it is legitamate, but not original. You will not be penalized for it, but we strongly urge caution to not cross over the line of cheesing.

Post by **tindertwiggy** » Fri Mar 19, 2004 3:18 pm

As of right now the ruling is we'll handle this case by case.

As for your case, let's move to the next step. Pm me with your character background. I have some things in mind and Orl recently laid down some info team side that will avlisify this idea. I would like to see what you have so far and work from there.

FunkOdyssey · Post by **FunkOdyssey** » Fri Mar 19, 2004 3:34 pm

Vroshgrak wrote:Just as Vrosh believes he is a descendant of The'ton!

Vrosh's real ancestor:

hehe